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Topic, Game "BLockoban"

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Jyxz 8 years ago
  Hah just to clarify for the second time I didn't say no dummy blocks, I said no EXTRA dummy blocks, which means if you can solve a level without a certain block it has to be taken out. That's all, what this is intended to do is make sure each level entered has had the required amount of care and refining to make it the best level it can be. For example jasper's recent level Tower Defence was a great challenge and I loved the level however if he wanted it included in the pack he would have to go back and refine it adding or taking out attachments and making sure that he has the exact amount of required white blocks (And by required I mean REQUIRED to solve not the same amount as the targets hah). Sorry for the confusion!

Edit: I know my rules my not be relevant anyway just thought I'd clarify!
azz 8 years ago
Dynamo I was joking!
BTW you should change your avatar to an 8 ball.
It's so much cooler!
Dynamo 8 years ago
  Azz, don't bother hinting, it'll just make them ignore you even more.
Its up to them whether or not they make you trusted, you won't be able persuade them.
'Trust' me. =P
azz 8 years ago
  I think i'm earning more kudos in blockoban!
People are liking my levels!
Maybe they are even starting to trust me!
SimonM 8 years ago
  I think that the pack should be made by the whole community and with a few people who co-ordinate it. And the pack should definately contain a level of the 20 best designers, as their levels are best rated. And I like the Idea that all levels should be completable in under 100 moves to keep tedious levels out. I would like to make the pack, but I think jp should make co-editors for packs, because making such a pack can be time-consuming.
About the dummy problem, if the dummies are needed to complete the level, then the level can be entered, according to me.
gameinsky 8 years ago
  The only problem is the thing with dummy blocks, sometimes dummy blocks are important for the design, and some people like to make their levels symmetrical if possible.

Disallowing dummy blocks prevents that.
magnacumlaud 8 years ago
  I think Jyxz idea including his 5 rules is a great, interesting and challenging plan. For me, I absolutely trust him and Simon: to make decisions concerning the new second official pack.
I prefer definitely Jyxz idea than Elizeas!
gameinsky 8 years ago
  Elizea, that's a very great alternative!
+ 1 support
Elizea 8 years ago
  Interesting. I remember that me and gameinsky had this conversation in the chat like a year ago... I think.

After the topics "New official levels" got abandoned, I've felt that officials are no more what they used to be. No more official levels pretty much ever came to games which we didn't really like. I think JP invented the pack idea partly because of this (if I remember right).

I can't say I like the situation as it is. People still somehow think that the amount of official levels make you "better" level maker or something.

The slideshow on front page was a try to highlight new good levels without making them official. It was working quite well for a while.

I guess we could have somekind of adding "points" to levels. Then 10 new levels (made that week) with most points would get to front page under "best levels of the week". User profile could show the amount of levels you have that are accepted, official and the total amount of levels you have had in the "best levels of the week".

The good point in this is that the levels are chosen by community, it can never become too "crowded" like official levels (too many of them) as it resets every week, but it still gives that feeling that you've made a very good level (:
gameinsky 8 years ago
  The second official pack idea was suggested to JP, the results are visible and are known as "levelpacks"

Unfortunately, JP is too busy in real life, so I'd be good if JP could "chose" someone to be the second official pack leader.
Ferrari12 8 years ago
  If I were to make such a pack in JG2, here's how I'd do it.
1. Assemble a team of 5 people (Me and Pof will be two of them)
2. Tell the community to post on/notify the team about any excellent levels they might find.
3. Once or twice a month, us in the team will take a look at all the good levels we and the community've found, and then make a list of those we think could be in the pack.
4. Send the list to JP.
5. Add the levels that got his approval.

No rules conserning the size of the pack, or how many levels one creator can have in the pack, or how many different creators' levels we'll have to put in.

Of course this won't work as smooth in BB as in JG2. JG2 has a smaller community, fewer levels and no level categories to worry about. That's my current plan, but constructive feedback and suggestions are always welcome.
oldmtnguy 8 years ago
  Let me start by saying I was all for this idea when it started, and I still am. But now I have some concerns over how the plan has evolved. I really like the idea of a second set of official levels, but we cannot decide to do this on our own. We are not the game creator nor have any business calling a level official or even acknowledged without jp's permission and approval.
The pack idea is a fine alternative, but it would need a different title. Say Players Favorites for instance. And we would need to come up with a voting system to choose the submissions. A pack containing levels chosen by Jyxz or Simon would be either Jyxz's Favorites or Simon's Favorites.
I agree that a fair system to choose is going to be difficult because of personal preferences and the friend factor. We are all highly intelligent players and I respect everyone's input. So let's continue to discuss this and come up with a firm proposal that I can present to jp.
If it ends up as a pack, jp has already told me that he will be able to place a link somewhere on the game page like he offered to do for the difficulty level packs when they are finished. So keep the comments coming and let's hear what you all have to say.
Jyxz 8 years ago
  I dont think the rating system is very reliable LMR but yeah of course if anyone thinks a level should be in it speak up!
lmr 8 years ago
  The first criteria should the highest rated levels. As obiviously they represent the best of that particular style. Also, the task should not be limited to one person, as each player has design/style preferences.
Perhaps several people from the upper echelon could submit thier top 25? 50? choices. There would be an overlap of choices which would create an overall list.
Jyxz 8 years ago
  Yeah "EXTRA" dummy blocks meaning blocks you dont use etc. etc. if they are 100% necessary it would be better if they had targets too but ya I am saying blocks that don't need to be used at all to attain a solution.
CamoDragoon 8 years ago
  @Jyxz that sounds great :)

About the dummy blocks though, I have a question, what if the dummy blocks are needed?
For example, my level Galaxy Dome (BLockoban) (I don't think it's official material anyway, but as an example)
In that case the dummy blocks are needed and placing goals for them would not only constrict the solutions but make it excessively hard to find the right way to solve it, and therefore I think it's better to have dummy blocks rather than goals. If this situation arises, are you just going examine it on a case-by-case basis?
Jyxz 8 years ago
  Simon if you want to make the Pack, I will definitely add a ton of my input.

For example I was thinking 100 levels total, with 6 kids 12 easy 24 medium 48 hard, then 10 slots we should have a level making contest for while we are putting the first 90 together... The kids levels important to have 1 example of each game mechanic (icy blocks, attached blocks). The easy levels should just be any really good easy levels that deserve it, on this I would ask people put forth a few of their own levels they would like to see featured. The medium levels same deal, but to get started I'd recommend a lot yours, Camo's and a few of Ferrari's levels. For the first half of the hard levels I'd like to see a few of the older classics from Jos and myself then a lot of newer stuff, Oldmtnguy prolly knows the more recent stuff way better then myself. Then the second half of the hard we need Toughman and Murat, I know murat doesn't speak much English, but if they could go threw especially their own levels and any levels that they actually consider hard I think should probably be featured.

A few general rules:
1) Absolutely no extra dummy blocks in any level.
2) All levels should be able to be solved in under 80 moves. Tedious can be fun when your bored but for an "official" level I'd prefer not to see it.
3) Any level with excessive attached blocks will be subject to scrutiny, because a level should be clever for its own merit not JUST because it has attached blocks. As has been shown before its possible to make a solvable level that no human will be able to. This is not an attack at murat since the majority of his levels are FANTASTIC but I think we all know some of them are a little excessive, (for example his level 400 =P).
4) Although it's hard to do because there will be disagreements I want to make it so each level his harder then all the previous. Level 1 <level 2-99 < level 100.
5) We will try to have at least one level from each active designer.

Let me know!
AK 8 years ago
  No, I mean the new evaluation category.
Ferrari12 8 years ago
  No, a pack with official-worthy levels, like a 2nd generation official level pack, with a link from the game's main page.

Official-worthy levels = leves that woud've been official if the game's creator could've bothered to add more official levels.
AK 8 years ago
  Oh, like levels that are accepted, but that you can still edit?
Ferrari12 8 years ago
  If you don't want to read the enormous messgaes below, I'll try to sum it up.

Jyxz, suggested a new evaluation category, between "accepted" and "to be edited". Then I said it would be a good idea, but instead, put it between "accepted" and "official". After that LMR and Jyxz came up with some other suggestion, and then we had the idea of "2nd Generation Official levels". After that OMR suggested maybe put those 2nd generation levels in a pack. Lastly I had some more suggestions in my post yesterday, which Simon has now told his opinions about.

I hope that made sense :)
AK 8 years ago
  I missed a lot... 0.0

What are we talking about?
SimonM 8 years ago
  Yes, links to the packs are very nice, they should do that too with category packs.
Jyxz 8 years ago
  @azz, yes.
azz 8 years ago
  Hendomino (BLockoban)
Is this level possible?
Ferrari12 8 years ago
  How about suggestion 2, then?
SimonM 8 years ago
  I normally have loads of time, so I could do some time consuming things. Anyway I think a "second official" pack would be cool.
@ferrari No awards needed.
Ferrari12 8 years ago
  A pack might actually be a very good idea. The admins fo the game (Or any peron(s) they've selcted to) could update the pack when they and the community thinks a level is deserving to be there.

I also have some other suggestions:
1. An award for creating a set ammount of acknowledged levels, e.g. Create 50? acknowledged levels; 150? EXP.
2. A link to the packs from the games' start page, to make it as visible to evryone as possible. Maybe also links on the BL main page.

If that dosn't require an enourmous cr*pload of work, I think that would work really well.

But somebody will have to notify JP about all this :)
CamoDragoon 8 years ago
  @OMR that might be the best solution to this, as I agree that making a new category would be really strenuous for JP (especially compared to your idea).
You also have to think that there are many other things JP could improve on other games, rather than just focusing on Blockoban. For example, curves in Rolling Turtle are rarely "correct" and there's many other things that JP could add to the interface of Jump Gear 2 as well.

I agree with all of the previous points stated, but I think that maybe OMR's idea would be the best.
And to add to that, maybe all the current officials could also be in that pack if you wanted to just make an official set compounded by the players? It could be continuously updated as new levels that deserved official status came along.
oldmanrob 8 years ago
  Why not do "Blockoban Official Second Generation" (OMG)in a pack? Jyxz could start the pack and people could pm him suggestions what levels they would like to see in.

Games forum

Play Game "BLockoban"

First post of the topic

jp 12 years ago
  sound on / off added (burfy's feedback).
16 official levels now. All levels are great. I must say I'm a big fan of Psychotronic's levels (thx Psycho). When a level is "only" accepted, it doesn't mean it will not be official one day, it's just I'm not sure for now.
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